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March 09, 2011


Strahler 70

Deutsche Islamophobe schützen häufig eine besondere Liebe zu Israel vor, um dem Vorwurf vorzubeugen, sie wären Rassisten. Wie könnten sie Rassisten sein, wenn sie doch für die Juden einträten, so die fadenscheinige Entschuldigung... Daß sich deren Sympathie aber einzig auf die araber- und islamfeindliche Likudpropaganda bezieht und von der Mehrheit der Juden mit Empörung zurückgewiesen wird, stört sie weiter nicht.


I don't think there is a witch-hunt on Muslims in Germany.

There will be a real one after a serious terror strike. But killing American soldiers on our soil is not what it takes to shake up the public.

And David, as always, you exclude the benefits of generalizations: They increase the sense of unity among the people and thus pave the way for the strong position of the leadership necessary for political reforms.


BY "generalizations" I guess you mean widespread racial prejudice.


Absolutely :-)

John in Michigan, USA

"I[f], like 99.99% of all Muslims they live peacefully and practice tolerance..."

If, 99.99% of the time, nuclear power plants operate without radiation leaks, wouldn't you agree that any discussion of the dangers of radiation leaks represent an irrational phobia?

See how silly the 99.99% argument is?

Suddenly a German historian/journalist, whose academic career and formal credentials suggest no specialization or focus on Islam, whose "study" of Islam appears to be limited to the publication of a few popular (i.e. non-academic, non-peer-reviewed) books, is cited as an expert on the incredibly complex question of Taquiya? The wonders never cease.

"Generalizations" about a religion are examples of widespread *racial* prejudice? Do you use language the way normal people do?


The nuclear analogy is just plain dumb. What are you suggesting? Detain all Muslims because a tiny minority are violent?

Bahners is a rationalist, and is as much of an expert on Islam as Ulfkotte , Sarrazin, etc -- whose speeches and books you are unable to read and therefore are not in a position to comment on...

John in Michigan, USA


I don't know whose comment you are responding to. It certainly isn't mine, since I did not discuss, either directly or by analogy, detaining anyone based on religion or electrical origin.


Isn't it just a bit disturbing to think that Ayaan Hirsi Ali will be speaking at SMCC in a couple of weeks?

John in Michigan, USA

I don't know why Ayaan Hirsi Ali is included in a list of "German Islamophobes".

She was first a Somali, then she became a Danish citizen. She still is a Dane, although she is now a legal resident (green card) of the USA. She spend a brief amount of time in Germany and has some family there, I don't see how that makes her German (she hasn't used this family connection to claim German citizenship).

Secondly, and more importantly, based on her personal, life experiences, it is *not* irrational for her to fear the style of Islam that she knows first-hand. Islam, as she experienced it, permitted and even blessed constant abuse, including mutilation of women, just for a start. Some Muslims, claiming to act in the name of Islam, made routine and credible death threats to her. Virtually all Muslim authorities would agree she is an apostate; I don't know of a single, prominent Muslim authority who has spoken out against the death penalty for that so-called crime.

Therefore, based on her first-person, direct, ongoing experience, it is not irrational (a phobia) for her to fear the Islam she knows.

She recognizes that there are more moderate elements in Islam; she discounts them as inauthentic. This may be a mistake, but if it is, it is an error in judgement, not a sign of irrational hate. She needs to avoid essentialism, the idea that Islam's negative traits are inherent or essential, and cannot ever change. But again, essentialism is just a conceptual mistake, it is not a sign of irrationality. Her positions in no way equate to a "phobia" (a term designed to invoke the specter of mental illness e.g. claustrophobia).

Until the more moderate Muslims regain the commanding heights of their religion, Ali's fears remain rational.

As to the others on the list, I don't know them well enough to comment.


Take it up with Patrick Bahners. BTW. I believe she is a Dutch citizen, not a Dane.

John in Michigan, USA

Oops she is Dutch, not Danish. Thanks for the correction.

I don't have access to Patrick Bahner's book, but let me just ask, are you certain he describes her as German in his book? That seems very odd. Is there a story there, or is he just lumping her in a category with the other "popular" "Islamophobes"

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